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2023-03-15: APP 2.0.0-beta14 has been released !

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Workflows for STC Astro DUO Filter

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(@daniel-tackley)
Brown Dwarf
Joined: 5 years ago
Posts: 3
Topic starter  

I have a STC Astro DUO Narrowband filter and was wondering whether anyone had any suggested workflows for processing data obtained using this filter and a OSC camera.

There are at least 2 ways I can see that this data might be processed:

  1. Use the Ha-OIII color debayer algorithm and treat the data as a standard RGB dataset
  2. Use the Ha-OIII mono, Ha-OIII extract Ha and Ha-OIII extract OIII algorithms to separate out mono (luminance?), Ha and OIII datasets for processing as bicolor or HOO

Method 1 above is pretty straightforward and this is how I have processed data so far.

What I am much less clear about is how I would use method 2 to generate separate but registered integrated mono, Ha and OIII files that could be combined using the combine tool or using other software? Any suggestions would be most welcome. At the moment, I can only think of selecting one of the debayer algorithms (e.g. mono) and running through all of the processes. After integration and the resulting file is saved, restart the whole process using the next debayer algorithm and repeat until all 3 files are saved. These may then need to be read back in for a final registration to make sure all are aligned. Is there an easier way? 

This topic was modified 4 years ago 2 times by Mabula-Admin

   
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(@dav78)
Neutron Star
Joined: 4 years ago
Posts: 85
 

Hi Daniel,

I use the way 1, as you do.

I've tried once Ha-OIII extract Ha, and the extract OIII, but it didn't work.

So, I'm also interested to know how to process properly the different channels  😉 


   
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(@mabula-admin)
Universe Admin
Joined: 6 years ago
Posts: 3457
 

Hi @daniel-tackley & @dav78,

Method 2) is preferred because you will be able to get much more and different colors in the bi-color composite.

It is quite stratightforward to accomplish what you want to do:

1) you will need the mono (for lum if you need/want is as well) and the extract algorithms

2) start with the Ha-OIII extract Ha (usually more signal so easier registration), process the data up until the Ha integration.

3) don't completely restart now

4) set the other debayer algortihm, for instance the Ha-OIII extract OIII,

5) now go to 5) normalize to normalize the OIII data. (no need to perform registration again, and this ensures the Ha and OIII integrations will be registered to each other)

6) Integrate the OIII data ,

The resulting integrations will be registered to each other thus are ready to load into the RGB Combine tool 😉

Let me know if this is clear and if you can follow this flow 😉

Kind regards,

Mabula

 

 


   
artem and Dav78 reacted
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(@dav78)
Neutron Star
Joined: 4 years ago
Posts: 85
 

Thank you Mabula for the answer.

I've tried this method and the result seems to be there (just need now to combine properly the two resulting pictures).

The integrate mode have to be set at no drizzle, the bayer drizzle won't work, right ?


   
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(@kijja)
Black Hole
Joined: 5 years ago
Posts: 149
 
Posted by: Mabula Haverkamp - Admin

Hi @daniel-tackley & @dav78,

Method 2) is preferred because you will be able to get much more and different colors in the bi-color composite.

It is quite stratightforward to accomplish what you want to do:

1) you will need the mono (for lum if you need/want is as well) and the extract algorithms

2) start with the Ha-OIII extract Ha (usually more signal so easier registration), process the data up until the Ha integration.

3) don't completely restart now

4) set the other debayer algortihm, for instance the Ha-OIII extract OIII,

5) now go to 5) normalize to normalize the OIII data. (no need to perform registration again, and this ensures the Ha and OIII integrations will be registered to each other)

6) Integrate the OIII data ,

The resulting integrations will be registered to each other thus are ready to load into the RGB Combine tool 😉

Let me know if this is clear and if you can follow this flow 😉

Kind regards,

Mabula

 

 

Hi,

My workflow for most of STC duo narrowband images exactly as Mabula's reply, However, I've founded that even the default AAD algorithm also works well in many situations. It also has an advantage that we can use bayer drizzle integration with the image. Here is my result on Thor's helmet.

thors23400

Cheers,

Kijja


   
artem reacted
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(@mabula-admin)
Universe Admin
Joined: 6 years ago
Posts: 3457
 
Posted by: Dav78

Thank you Mabula for the answer.

I've tried this method and the result seems to be there (just need now to combine properly the two resulting pictures).

The integrate mode have to be set at no drizzle, the bayer drizzle won't work, right ?

Hi @dav78,

I think it will, have you tried ?

Mabula


   
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(@mabula-admin)
Universe Admin
Joined: 6 years ago
Posts: 3457
 
Posted by: Kijja
Posted by: Mabula Haverkamp - Admin

Hi @daniel-tackley & @dav78,

Method 2) is preferred because you will be able to get much more and different colors in the bi-color composite.

It is quite stratightforward to accomplish what you want to do:

1) you will need the mono (for lum if you need/want is as well) and the extract algorithms

2) start with the Ha-OIII extract Ha (usually more signal so easier registration), process the data up until the Ha integration.

3) don't completely restart now

4) set the other debayer algortihm, for instance the Ha-OIII extract OIII,

5) now go to 5) normalize to normalize the OIII data. (no need to perform registration again, and this ensures the Ha and OIII integrations will be registered to each other)

6) Integrate the OIII data ,

The resulting integrations will be registered to each other thus are ready to load into the RGB Combine tool 😉

Let me know if this is clear and if you can follow this flow 😉

Kind regards,

Mabula

 

 

Hi,

My workflow for most of STC duo narrowband images exactly as Mabula's reply, However, I've founded that even the default AAD algorithm also works well in many situations. It also has an advantage that we can use bayer drizzle integration with the image. Here is my result on Thor's helmet.

thors23400

Cheers,

Kijja

Hi @kijja,

If you use AAD deabayering and set the integration mode to Bayer Drizzle, no debayering is done to create the integration (the data is debayered while performing star analysis and normalization, not for the actual integration) 😉 which is preferred !

If you set the mode to Drizzle, then debayering is done, and the debayered data is then drizzled, which is not ideal.

Mabula


   
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(@daniel-tackley)
Brown Dwarf
Joined: 5 years ago
Posts: 3
Topic starter  

All seems to be working well using the method detailed by Mabula above. Just need to work out now whether there is any benefit from generating a mono image to use as a luminance layer or if just the Ha and OIII images have enough info. Also need to work out the best way to combine the individual images. Here are a couple of examples created using StarTools to process the APP integrations.

Heart Nebula Bicolor v4
Rosette Nebula Bicolour

   
artem and Mabula-Admin reacted
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(@mabula-admin)
Universe Admin
Joined: 6 years ago
Posts: 3457
 

Excellent @daniel-tackley,

Thanks for sharing 😉

Mabula


   
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(@tsk1979)
Red Giant
Joined: 4 years ago
Posts: 52
 

@mabula-admin

I am confused. I just downloaded the trial version and I am very new to processing. I captured frames (ARW files from my sony camera) with Duo Narrowband filter. I have a full spectrum A7S and use duo narrowband with that camera.

 

I saw the instructions, but I am confused. I load the light frames into the APP, and then what? When I select filter I can only select one band, not both Oxygen and H-Alpha.

A newbie guide please?


   
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(@vincent-mod)
Universe Admin
Joined: 6 years ago
Posts: 5391
 

Hi @tsk1979 did you try the above steps mentioned by Mabula? The option to extract one from the other can be found in tab(0) and scrolling down the list of the CFA algorithm.


   
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(@tsk1979)
Red Giant
Joined: 4 years ago
Posts: 52
 

@vincent-mod

There is tab(1) load frames. Where is tab(0)?

Is there a view tutorial for the steps?


   
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(@vincent-mod)
Universe Admin
Joined: 6 years ago
Posts: 5391
 

Not really yet, we have the video's, but those are getting a bit outdated. Mabula is working on a PDF to explain the entire program.

This is tab 0 and the options are at the algorithm part.

Screenshot 2019 08 04 at 19.56.04

 


   
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(@tsk1979)
Red Giant
Joined: 4 years ago
Posts: 52
 

Okay, so first I have to split. When I split images, it just splits into R,G,B 

How to split frames into Ha-OIII using APP?


   
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(@kijja)
Black Hole
Joined: 5 years ago
Posts: 149
 

@tsk1979

To extract OIII (or Ha) from duo-narrow band filter is simple. Stay in Tab 0) Raw/Fits, under 'algorithm' pull menu. Find the menu 'Ha-OIII extract OIII' which is the lower most of the pull menu and select this. Then you can load duo narrow band files and process in normal routine. The final integration will be the stacked OIII.

Cheers,

Kijja


   
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(@tsk1979)
Red Giant
Joined: 4 years ago
Posts: 52
 

@kijja

So I should do processing twice?

1st Halpha then OIII and then combine the processed images. How to combine? Photoshop? Any tutorial links? I have always done standard RGB this is my first brush with NarrowbaND


   
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(@tsk1979)
Red Giant
Joined: 4 years ago
Posts: 52
 

OK, I got it 🙂

Thanks. Now I feel really stupid! Will share the results!

 

EDIT: My Ha and OIII integrations both look the same.

 

After integrating Halpha I should go back to "0" change to OIII and them simply go straight to "5"?

 

This post was modified 4 years ago by Tanveer Singh

   
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(@tsk1979)
Red Giant
Joined: 4 years ago
Posts: 52
 

Here are my samples. I am unable to figure what I am doing wrong.

My Ha and OIII both look same. Check out the file names. They are correct. But content looks similar.

After integrating Ha, I changed Algo and went to Step 5 directory

1
2

   
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(@kijja)
Black Hole
Joined: 5 years ago
Posts: 149
 

@tsk1979

There should be something wrong. Both extracted files must be in monochrome. Did you check the 'force Bayer CFA'? Just leave it uncheck.

Kijja


   
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(@tsk1979)
Red Giant
Joined: 4 years ago
Posts: 52
 

@kijja

 start with the Ha-OIII extract Ha (usually more signal so easier registration), process the data up until the Ha integration.

 

This step means I have to do integration or go to step 5 right after  Normalize?

 

Here are screenshots of my steps (0-3)

What am I doing wrong?

 

3
4
2
1

 


   
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(@tsk1979)
Red Giant
Joined: 4 years ago
Posts: 52
 

My Integration settings

image

   
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(@kijja)
Black Hole
Joined: 5 years ago
Posts: 149
 

@tsk1979

Your setting looks fine for me. @vincent-mod could you share some ideas about this? Does it due to un-support bayer matrix?

Kijja 

(btw Tanveer, could you still get good image from 'HaOIII color' algorithm?)


   
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(@tsk1979)
Red Giant
Joined: 4 years ago
Posts: 52
 
Posted by: @kijja

@tsk1979

Your setting looks fine for me. @vincent-mod could you share some ideas about this? Does it due to un-support bayer matrix?

Kijja 

(btw Tanveer, could you still get good image from 'HaOIII color' algorithm?)

I am unable to get meaningful Blues. Here is my result final processed imagte

image

   
artem and Kijja reacted
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(@kijja)
Black Hole
Joined: 5 years ago
Posts: 149
 

@tsk1979

Your image is promising, it will shine with details when more signal is added. Eager to see the final image!

Cheers,

Kijja


   
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(@tsk1979)
Red Giant
Joined: 4 years ago
Posts: 52
 

Hydrogen is overwhelming the oxygen. How to increase oxygen?

 


   
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(@wvreeven)
Quasar
Joined: 5 years ago
Posts: 2102
 

The best way to do that: shoot (many) more OIII images.


   
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(@tsk1979)
Red Giant
Joined: 4 years ago
Posts: 52
 

@wvreeven

Its a OIII Ha Filter. So I cannot shoot more OIII


   
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(@vincent-mod)
Universe Admin
Joined: 6 years ago
Posts: 5391
 
Posted by: @kijja

@tsk1979

Your setting looks fine for me. @vincent-mod could you share some ideas about this? Does it due to un-support bayer matrix?

Kijja 

(btw Tanveer, could you still get good image from 'HaOIII color' algorithm?)

Not really as I never used such a filter myself. I can help more if you share the raw data to see if I can process them correctly, I can then make a clearer workflow maybe. You can upload data to our APP server: server with login/password: appuser
Please create a folder with your name on it first, thank you.

Besides that, more data always helps, the OIII is a bit less bright as Ha if I'm not mistaken on this object. But let's have a look at the data first.


   
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(@tsk1979)
Red Giant
Joined: 4 years ago
Posts: 52
 

@vincent-mod

Thanks

I have made folder tsk1979 with 3 subfolders

1. Veil Nebula Ha-OIII

2. Andromeda Ha-OIII

3. Dark frames (For both)

Files are uploading. I see them in the Upload Queue (Uploading at 12Mbps currently). I started with Veil Nebula upload


   
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(@vincent-mod)
Universe Admin
Joined: 6 years ago
Posts: 5391
 

Great, I'll get to them this evening or tomorrow.


   
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